georg
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Post by georg on Jul 1, 2022 18:57:38 GMT
I don't believe it was discussed back when the News of the World box set came out in 2017, but I recently gave the Raw Sessions a listen again and was charmed again by Who Needs You.
John is playing acoustic guitar, Brian is shaking the maracas, and Freddie is singing (and maybe hitting the cowbell). But who's playing bass? Logic would dictate that it would be John, but considering he's already occupied on acoustic, and neither the arrangement nor the lyrics were finished and the song was still being worked out, and this take certainly wasn't going to be used for the master, there would be no reason to overdub a bass line.
Any thoughts on who this mystery bassist is? Could it be Roger? Did John overdub bass onto a take they weren't going to use? Let's try to figure it out.
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Lord Fickle
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Post by Lord Fickle on Jul 1, 2022 19:06:46 GMT
Given that the Raw Sessions are bits of stuff patched together, might it be reasonable to consider that the track we hear could have been created out of various parts, and therefore the bass may have been mixed in later?
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georg
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Post by georg on Jul 1, 2022 20:47:45 GMT
Given that the Raw Sessions are bits of stuff patched together, might it be reasonable to consider that the track we hear could have been created out of various parts, and therefore the bass may have been mixed in later? That's possible, but it seems like an odd thing to add on, considering the roughness of the track. Gosh, if only the liner notes were informative..
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Lord Fickle
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Post by Lord Fickle on Jul 1, 2022 20:52:59 GMT
How do we know John is playing acoustic guitar, Brian is shaking the maracas, and Freddie is singing (and maybe hitting the cowbell)? Is that in the liner notes? Sorry, not looked at the box set for ages.
If Freddie was shaking the maracas, Brian could have played bass?
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ted
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Post by ted on Jul 1, 2022 21:33:10 GMT
I think the most plausible explanation is that the bass was mixed in later. I would consider Brian having played bass to be the 2nd most likely scenario.
Ted
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Post by angusscrimm on Jul 2, 2022 0:24:09 GMT
Liner notes simply say acoustic guitars by John and Brian, maracas by Brian and cowbell by Freddie. Nothing too detailed at all. I'm thinking Brian on regular, John on acoustic bass and maracas added in later. Or....QPL f**k up on the notes and it's Roger on maracas. Or...QPL f**k up and it's just John on guitar and Brian on maracas....
meanwhile, my ears are confused listening for bass in the first place. I've always been fooled into thinking it's just plain old acoustic guitar and it was Freddie/John mostly.
Someone ask Brian. He'll probably come up with something completely different.
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georg
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Post by georg on Jul 2, 2022 0:58:31 GMT
It’s almost definitely John on acoustic guitar, as he works through the intro guitar pattern with Freddie, and the guitar performance/tone sounds similar to the final take, which is John.
The reason I argue it may be Roger is because he already played bass on his two songs on the album (and Brian hasn’t been credited as playing bass on any Queen song), so it feels more likely to me that he would deputize on an early take.
The best place to have clarified this would have been the liners, but leave it to QPL to underwhelm in that regard….
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dysan
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Post by dysan on Jul 2, 2022 6:49:42 GMT
It might have been flown in from another take, but I'd say the most likely explanation was that John added it to make a 'complete' take if that was the one they kept. Although it sounds like they are sat next to each other working out the part, they'd have been in booths with headphones so Fred's scratch vocal could be mixed out. I'd also wager the percussion is overdubbed too.
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cmi
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Post by cmi on Jul 2, 2022 7:26:38 GMT
There are no any linear notes in NOTW box. Which is a real shame. QPL must learn from Apple Corps. how to work properly on archive releases.
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georg
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Post by georg on Jul 2, 2022 11:33:15 GMT
I might have been flown in from another take, but I'd say the most likely explanation was that John added it to make a 'complete' take if that was the one they kept. Although it sounds like they are sat next to each other working out the part, they'd have been in booths with headphones so Fred's scratch vocal could be mixed out. I'd also wager the percussion is overdubbed too. Thats a good point – maybe I’m being too strict with how “loose” the take is, and I’m assuming it’s a live take because that’s how it seems to be presented. But you may be right: maybe John liked Take 2 from a musical standpoint, and overdubbed bass and percussion or whatever else, before deciding another take could be used. Or maybe QPL just mashed up a bunch of takes into a hybrid mix without saying a word, and they’ve fooled me into believing their lies.
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flyaway
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Post by flyaway on Jul 3, 2022 2:53:45 GMT
Ooh, I saw what you did there Georg! Nice!
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georg
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Post by georg on Jul 3, 2022 16:57:23 GMT
Ooh, I saw what you did there Georg! Nice! what i do
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Lord Fickle
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Post by Lord Fickle on Jul 3, 2022 17:01:41 GMT
Ooh, I saw what you did there Georg! Nice! what i do I wondered that as well.
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Post by 85guild on Jul 3, 2022 17:40:18 GMT
I think the poster thinking you wrote you're fooled into believing their lies was an effort to tie into the I'm a fool for I believed your lies from the song. This ends my days as board detective
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georg
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Post by georg on Jul 3, 2022 19:37:34 GMT
I think the poster thinking you wrote you're fooled into believing their lies was an effort to tie into the I'm a fool for I believed your lies from the song. This ends my days as board detective Oh! Uh, yeah I totally meant, uhh, besides that! Definitely. Yup.
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Post by manymilesaway on Jul 4, 2022 1:13:01 GMT
I think the poster thinking you wrote you're fooled into believing their lies was an effort to tie into the I'm a fool for I believed your lies from the song. This ends my days as board detective And this is why we use quotation marks, everybody.
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cmsdrums
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Post by cmsdrums on Jul 7, 2022 15:01:27 GMT
There is a quick double-tap on a cowbell off-mic whilst they’re talking at the start, but I can’t detect any other cowbell on the track?
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dysan
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Post by dysan on Jul 8, 2022 4:37:07 GMT
Was probably in the percussion pile and given a playful tap as whoever got ready to overdub. Done that sort of thing many times Sounds almost like a conductor tapping his stand at the start of a performance. Two observations: John says something about doing the 'old' intro. As this is take 2, I wonder if this is actually an older song that they've been messing around with for a while so were familiar with an 'old' intro. Seems strange to say if they've just started working on the song that day as it sounds like? Also on the bass playing - I would conclude it is John as it comes in directly off the count in, which I doubt another player would've done so cleanly if they were all mucking about and changing the intro on the fly.
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georg
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Post by georg on Jul 8, 2022 17:51:59 GMT
Two observations: John says something about doing the 'old' intro. As this is take 2, I wonder if this is actually an older song that they've been messing around with for a while so were familiar with an 'old' intro. Seems strange to say if they've just started working on the song that day as it sounds like? Theres the rumor that a reggae arrangement was recorded, so maybe the acoustic arrangement was first attempted, then they tried a reggae arrangement that they didn’t like, and went back to the “old” intro. Or they did Take 1 with a new intro that wasn’t liked, so they went with the old one. Again, if only QPL would give us some insight…
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BrƎИsꓘi
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Post by BrƎИsꓘi on Jul 8, 2022 21:46:48 GMT
Two observations: John says something about doing the 'old' intro. As this is take 2, I wonder if this is actually an older song that they've been messing around with for a while so were familiar with an 'old' intro. Seems strange to say if they've just started working on the song that day as it sounds like? Theres the rumor that a reggae arrangement was recorded, so maybe the acoustic arrangement was first attempted, then they tried a reggae arrangement that they didn’t like, and went back to the “old” intro. Or they did Take 1 with a new intro that wasn’t liked, so they went with the old one. Again, if only QPL would give us some insight… i'd give my right knacker for a reggae version of that! really.
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