BrƎИsꓘi
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They called it paradise, I don't know why...You call some place paradise, kiss it goodbye.
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Post by BrƎИsꓘi on Sept 26, 2021 9:59:23 GMT
The SOLDIER SAILOR TINKER TAILOR PLOUGH-BOY part actually sounds normal to my ears as well. I think the falsetto in "to see a fellow crack a nut at night's moon time" sounds very off though, almost robotic sounding yep. I've commented on the "crack" bit before - the irony that the voice sounds like it's cracking at that time. On the 'PLOUGH-BOY' part of that line, It sounds rather unnatural, whereas on the 'Hero' line (After dragonfly trumpeter line), it sounds normal (To me at least). How much it's pitch-corrected is up for debate, but considering the odd sound of Fred's voice on the former, It's probably more than just a minor edit. i agree. it's easy to assume the never-before-heard live rendition of FF would be heavily tweaked to make it "good enough" for official release. had it been anywhere near good enough, the LP would've seen light-of-day decades earlier, surely? i still think they not only pitch-corrected the vocals quite heavily but also flew in a lot of stuff from the Queen 2 multis (maybe from an alternate take). It just doesn't sound 100% live to me. Then again, the whole release sounds so artificial, it's off-putting. for sure. the whole recording sounds unlike any other live LP I've ever heard, a little cosmetic in places, with much of the organic qualities of other live LPs sadly absent. wonder if though, instead of using Queen II multis, they have used recorded rehearsal tapes? Rehearsal recordings would ensure at least one "safety" recording to use and retain a little of the live authenticity. I'm sure rehearsal tapes were used more than we know, Ozzy did similar - passing off an entire rehearsal tune as "live", when the band recorded You Said It All pre-gig in 1980.
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Lord Fickle
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Post by Lord Fickle on Sept 26, 2021 10:06:12 GMT
the whole recording sounds unlike any other live LP I've ever heard, a little cosmetic in places, with much of the organic qualities of other live LPs sadly absent. wonder if though, instead of using Queen II multis, they have used recorded rehearsal tapes? Rehearsal recordings would ensure at least one "safety" recording to use and retain a little of the live authenticity. It certainly doesn't sound like a 1974 recording would sound unaltered. But I like it. I love the compressed drum sound, and I assume they must have had multitracks to have been able to manipulate it in the way they did?
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Post by mrmarioanonym on Sept 26, 2021 18:52:08 GMT
i think it sounds hideous. noise-reduced, overcompressed, drenched in cheesy digital reverb (that doesn't even attempt to sound real), pitch-corrected to hell and back and somewhat unbalanced.
about the origin of Fairy Feller, i doubt they in their financial situation could have afforded to multitrack a rehearsal.
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Post by straycatbeatles on Sept 26, 2021 22:53:26 GMT
Have you ever heard the very 'unique' tone Freddie uses on the word 'ploughboy' on any other live recording? I definitely haven't. It's been heavily tinkered with, especially 'see the feller crack a nut at night's moon time'. The way he switches from chest voice on 'see' to falsetto for the rest of the line sounds robotic! 'Sound' on 'wait till you hear the sound' sounds very strange, probably Freddie running out of breath and trying to strain his way through the line. Do we know if Freddie had a cold at this time? His voice sounds very raspy and nasally, perhaps why they chose to tinker with certain lines. Idk if it's just me but my mind keeps thinking Roger is singing that line. It probably isn't though.
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n39
Ploughman
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Post by n39 on Sept 27, 2021 14:17:11 GMT
Have you ever heard the very 'unique' tone Freddie uses on the word 'ploughboy' on any other live recording? I definitely haven't. It's been heavily tinkered with, especially 'see the feller crack a nut at night's moon time'. The way he switches from chest voice on 'see' to falsetto for the rest of the line sounds robotic! 'Sound' on 'wait till you hear the sound' sounds very strange, probably Freddie running out of breath and trying to strain his way through the line. Do we know if Freddie had a cold at this time? His voice sounds very raspy and nasally, perhaps why they chose to tinker with certain lines. Idk if it's just me but my mind keeps thinking Roger is singing that line. It probably isn't though. Which one?
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Post by mercurialfreddie on Sept 27, 2021 20:22:59 GMT
'Sound'... the effects applied here just makes my ears cringe, definitely it was pitched and auto-tuned. For tinkering only with that one particular word someone should take responsibility: a tinkerer and the person who - when hearing the final mix - gave it the green light!
What is more, a chatter / banter right after the song has been definitely cut out if you listen closely to the mix, Freddie's "Tell you what..." is just like a door bashed in, Roger's "thank you" doesn't have much time here to sound.
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Dimitris
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Post by Dimitris on Sept 28, 2021 4:55:26 GMT
I still can't hear any autotune or other things...I'm getting older.
If I remember correctly, someone posted in QZ that, his mother was in a Queen concert. FFMS was played, The poster was almost beaten by replies that he was fake and spam, no evidences.
It is a very difficult song to reproduce live, only if another concert surfaces, we will find out.
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Lord Fickle
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Post by Lord Fickle on Sept 28, 2021 9:09:01 GMT
I still can't hear any autotune or other things...I'm getting older. If I remember correctly, someone posted in QZ that, his mother was in a Queen concert. FFMS was played, The poster was almost beaten by replies that he was fake and spam, no evidences. It is a very difficult song to reproduce live, only if another concert surfaces, we will find out. Well, somebody must have been there, and wasn't FFMS performed more than once? I do find it a little sad that we were given a track that no one knew existed before (I don't think we knew that they'd ever performed FFMS until then), yet people complain about it possibly being tweaked. I just think it was great to hear a live version of something we hadn't heard before.
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BrƎИsꓘi
Administrator
They called it paradise, I don't know why...You call some place paradise, kiss it goodbye.
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Post by BrƎИsꓘi on Sept 28, 2021 10:52:34 GMT
I do find it a little sad that we were given a track that no one knew existed before (I don't think we knew that they'd ever performed FFMS until then), yet people complain about it possibly being tweaked. I just think it was great to hear a live version of something we hadn't heard before. exactly. yes, the live rendition is up for analysis and scrutiny, but not to the point of complaint about its very existence. just plain daft.
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Post by mercurialfreddie on Sept 28, 2021 11:30:26 GMT
Hasn't it been mentioned in the QZ post (ahh, old times!) that during some 70's tour in Providenece some fan was screaming song-after-song, demanding FFMS to be played and the band did the quick instrumental bit live ?
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n39
Ploughman
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Post by n39 on Sept 28, 2021 12:33:14 GMT
Hasn't it been mentioned in the QZ post (ahh, old times!) that during some 70's tour in Providenece some fan was screaming song-after-song, demanding FFMS to be played and the band did the quick instrumental bit live ? It was only (as far as we know) played fully live four times: Blackpool (1st March 1974), Sunderland (8th March 1974), Rainbow, London (31st March 1974), Birmingham (2nd April 1974). In Santa Monica, California (29th March 1975), an audience member kept yelling for The Fairy Feller's Master-Stroke between songs, and to appease him Freddie played a ten second snippet of the intro on piano.
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Post by mercurialfreddie on Sept 28, 2021 14:40:02 GMT
Hasn't it been mentioned in the QZ post (ahh, old times!) that during some 70's tour in Providenece some fan was screaming song-after-song, demanding FFMS to be played and the band did the quick instrumental bit live ? It was only (as far as we know) played fully live four times: Blackpool (1st March 1974), Sunderland (8th March 1974), Rainbow, London (31st March 1974), Birmingham (2nd April 1974). In Santa Monica, California (29th March 1975), an audience member kept yelling for The Fairy Feller's Master-Stroke between songs, and to appease him Freddie played a ten second snippet of the intro on piano. Ahhh ! Sorry! So I was thinking about Santa Monica, but brought up Providence, silly me ! Thanks n39!
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Post by mercurialfreddie on Sept 28, 2021 14:41:56 GMT
I wonder how did it go for all the guys during the Birmingham 74' shows. If it's true that the band in the early days were very often listening back to the tape-recordings of the shows then Birmingham concert's FFMS should sound awesome.
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Setzer
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Post by Setzer on Sept 28, 2021 18:21:06 GMT
I wonder how did it go for all the guys during the Birmingham 74' shows. If it's true that the band in the early days were very often listening back to the tape-recordings of the shows then Birmingham concert's FFMS should sound awesome.Why would you assume that?? I also can't help but laugh at those of you denying/questioning the pitch correction and auto-tune on this release... It's right in your face! How can you miss it???
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Post by jacquesdaniels on Sept 28, 2021 19:50:26 GMT
Yeah, I'd say it's Auto-Tuned, because if they'd been using Melodyne, they would've more likely gotten cleaner vocal corrections. To those of you unfamiliar with how Auto-Tune and Melodyne work, they calculate and adjust the melodic lines to a perfectly tuned pitch, although Melodyne seems to go with a somehow softer adjusting protocol - you get fairly organic, if still notable, results with that.
Freddie was, as has been mentioned by both Brian and Roger lately, a pretty wild singer in the early days, sometimes to the point of being a bit out of control. Early concert bootlegs certainly prove this to be true, and Freddie's vibrato in particular was often a bit out of tune. Pitch-correcting a vibrato like Freddie had then, could be practically impossible to clean up, and if you get any voice cracks, pitch-correcting often makes it sound worse than if it were not corrected. It should be pretty easy to spot, since the vocal loses a certain amount of human character, and I can definitely hear symptoms of careless pitch-correction in the Rainbow FFMS. In a way, I'm a bit surprised they even bothered to work on it so far as to release it, but on the other hand, a rarity like that is a good way to entice fans to buy the music regardless of how it's produced.
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Post by chadhanging on Oct 1, 2021 20:44:18 GMT
I really hope no one goes back and tries to "cancel" them for the N-word. That's big these days. Hopefully we can start being more objective soon.
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VitasDB
Wordles & Heardles
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Post by VitasDB on Oct 5, 2021 11:04:54 GMT
I really hope no one goes back and tries to "cancel" them for the N-word. That's big these days. Hopefully we can start being more objective soon. Sadly that already happened on Twitter some months ago.
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Post by straycatbeatles on Oct 20, 2021 5:46:18 GMT
Idk if it's just me but my mind keeps thinking Roger is singing that line. It probably isn't though. Which one? "To see the feller crack a nut at night's moon-time". The only thing that makes me think that it isn't Roger saying that part is how quick the transition is between Freddie's normal voice, and the raspier delivery for the rest of the lyric. Either way, that one part sticks out pretty badly once you notice it.
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BrƎИsꓘi
Administrator
They called it paradise, I don't know why...You call some place paradise, kiss it goodbye.
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Post by BrƎИsꓘi on Oct 25, 2021 8:10:19 GMT
'Sound'... the effects applied here just makes my ears cringe, definitely it was pitched and auto-tuned. For tinkering only with that one particular word someone should take responsibility: a tinkerer and the person who - when hearing the final mix - gave it the green light! but you, me, none of us, have heard the original. perhaps the adjustments made have arrived at the best possible result? perhaps the original sound was so bad: “What if this is as good as it gets?” [thanks, Melvin]
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Post by mrmarioanonym on Oct 25, 2021 14:32:16 GMT
i doubt that this is as good as it gets.
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BrƎИsꓘi
Administrator
They called it paradise, I don't know why...You call some place paradise, kiss it goodbye.
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Post by BrƎИsꓘi on Oct 25, 2021 16:04:50 GMT
i doubt that this is as good as it gets. well, you can doubt all you like - but until you hear the raw audio, you will never know one way (or the other) for sure...which is precise why i used the word perhaps. ...and, we are talking about a band who are known for being perfectionists. do you really doubt that Brian and Roger would've released this track in anything but its best possible state?
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Post by akirafish on Dec 4, 2021 15:46:38 GMT
This analysis video is relevant to the subject.
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Post by ActionThisDay on Dec 5, 2021 15:05:22 GMT
So it's true then, the band are now putting out official product with Freddie's voice auto-tuned in a pretty obvious manner. Disgusting.
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Post by angusscrimm on Dec 7, 2021 1:34:54 GMT
Regardless of pitch correction (alleged/actual...whatever) I nearly lost my shit when this came out. Didn't think they had ever played it live, so what we got is better than never having heard it at all. I loved it and still do.
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Post by ActionThisDay on Dec 8, 2021 15:43:26 GMT
Regardless of pitch correction (alleged/actual...whatever) I nearly lost my shit when this came out. Didn't think they had ever played it live, so what we got is better than never having heard it at all. I loved it and still do. Nothing alleged about it, the pitch correction is definitely there. It seems that no-one knew that they had ever performed FFMS until this release. The song was only performed a few times in 1974.
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alepisa
Tatterdemalion
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Post by alepisa on Dec 9, 2021 14:30:13 GMT
If I remeber well, that track on QZ was created using the live snippets and the studio version mixing together simulating a live rendition
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Post by The Real Wizard on Dec 9, 2021 19:10:11 GMT
Regardless of pitch correction (alleged/actual...whatever) I nearly lost my shit when this came out. Didn't think they had ever played it live, so what we got is better than never having heard it at all. I loved it and still do. Bang on. The surprise element alone completely outweighs the fact that they did a tiny of post work in Pro Tools. It doesn't bother me in the least.
They may well release most things for the man on the street, but this was an exception. They did not have to include that disc at all - it's almost certainly the best thing they've put out this side of Y2K.
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Raf
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Post by Raf on Dec 13, 2021 14:41:28 GMT
Got to be honest, I can't hear pitch correction either, even when it's been pointed out to me with a big stick. I'm glad I'm not the only one! That said, I was very surprised to hear him go for the high note in "PLOUGHBOY", and I guess it could be said that it sounds slightly suspicious. I'm only saying I personally can't hear any obvious tweaking - that doesn't mean it isn't there. Thanks for the reply, glad I'm not the only one too! On the word PLOUGHBOY, Freddie's voice ever-so-slightly breaks, which suggests to me that it was actually sung like that. There are some channels on YouTube where people autotune vocals from famous classic rock bands, often beginning with minor tweaking (to prove the slightly off notes are a very important part of the singer's expression) and ending with them just messing around and shifting large steps. The way "PLOUGHBOY" sounds in this album sounds an awful lot like the latter example. Either Freddie really did strain himself a lot to sing that note without falsetto and his voice cracked or he spared himself, sang it way lower and someone in the studio thought it was a good idea to fix it. Here's an extreme example (~6:00 in the video): However, they didn't make "waiting to hear the SOUND" higher, which comes right next. I guess that'd be evidence against them messing too much with Freddie's pitch. Either way, like others have said here, I think it's fantastic we got to hear this song live, with or without a couple of fixes here and there. The fact that we're unsure about which points were definitely fixed just shows how great they were back in the day!
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