vh
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Post by vh on Apr 3, 2024 16:21:28 GMT
I think personally the only thing to do is to take no notice of Greg Brooks.
When his book Queen Live A Concert Documentary was published in 1995 it claimed to be accurately researched and documented. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Through the years he has made claims from “Fairy Fellow’s Master Stroke was never played live (the above mentioned book proves the fact by not listing it in any setlist!) to a Live Killers Box Set is on the way, still waiting. In fact that long touring cycle was shorter than the wait!
It would be far better if he never went public about anything and allowed whatever is going to be released come as a surprise rather than leaving people very often discussing something that probably doesn’t exist. There are far better and more accurate sources of info available from certain members of this forum, sometimes through websites they have painstakingly worked at through the years.
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Post by airpodsmax on Apr 3, 2024 21:18:35 GMT
I figured it out a long time ago. If don’t wait for anything on purpose, then something will happen. It’s just that when wait for something on purpose, what comes out is not what need. Although I agree, even when wait, don’t get what wanted. For example, we were already tired of waiting, but we were waiting for the release of Rainbow concert 1974 and now the release happened, but most of us were not waiting for a compilation of two concerts, but a separate release. Then, due to Covid, the release of the Miracle album box set was postponed. The release is finally out. Some people liked it, some didn’t. Depends on the level of expectations.
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manymilesaway
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Post by manymilesaway on Apr 5, 2024 8:46:23 GMT
even when wait, don’t get what wanted. we were waiting for the release of Rainbow concert 1974 and now the release happened, but most of us were not waiting for a compilation of two concerts, but a separate release. Honestly- that's totally true, I agree. I think I'm always going to be somewhat disappointed with most things Queen Productions puts out. I wasn't around in the fanbase when the Rainbow official release happened, but I'd be pretty mad if that happened today. In my opinion, the November part of that release is probably the worst live release that Queen's ever put out- and yes, that includes Live Magic!
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Post by airpodsmax on Apr 5, 2024 14:44:11 GMT
even when wait, don’t get what wanted. we were waiting for the release of Rainbow concert 1974 and now the release happened, but most of us were not waiting for a compilation of two concerts, but a separate release. Honestly- that's totally true, I agree. I think I'm always going to be somewhat disappointed with most things Queen Productions puts out. I wasn't around in the fanbase when the Rainbow official release happened, but I'd be pretty mad if that happened today. In my opinion, the November part of that release is probably the worst live release that Queen's ever put out- and yes, that includes Live Magic! You are terribly wrong about the worst November release. The fact that they couldn’t find a video of a March concert of the same year and on the same venue for more than three songs is what I would call the worst.The funny thing is that they asked fans who had videos of this concert more than three song, to send them a copy. Regarding the worst release, I would say Hammersmith Odeon 1975. They cut off Bob Harris's speech at the beginning, replacing only his voice.
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manymilesaway
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Post by manymilesaway on Apr 5, 2024 15:48:09 GMT
Honestly- that's totally true, I agree. I think I'm always going to be somewhat disappointed with most things Queen Productions puts out. I wasn't around in the fanbase when the Rainbow official release happened, but I'd be pretty mad if that happened today. In my opinion, the November part of that release is probably the worst live release that Queen's ever put out- and yes, that includes Live Magic! You are terribly wrong about the worst November release. The fact that they couldn’t find a video of a March concert of the same year and on the same venue for more than three songs is what I would call the worst.The funny thing is that they asked fans who had videos of this concert more than three song, to send them a copy. Regarding the worst release, I would say Hammersmith Odeon 1975. They cut off Bob Harris's speech at the beginning, replacing only his voice. Nah, the November release is horrible in every way. The audio mix is terrible and the video editing is HORRIBLE. They don't even bother checking Roger's clothes, it changes just about every other shot. I could go on and on about how AWFUL the audio mix on November is, I cannot believe that that got out the way it did. How do you drown your mix in bass and yet I STILL can't hear Deacon?? The pitch correction is absolutely terrible in November, it's the worst I've ever heard from Queen. Freddie does not sound human. With March Rainbow, I can atleast understand the lackluster video release- what else are they supposed to do if they genuinely don't have all the footage? But the March audio mix is INSANELY GOOD, like easily the best officially released mix imo.
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Post by Chopin1995 on Apr 5, 2024 17:32:44 GMT
I agree with you Miles. I always thought November Rainbow is unbearable, but never said anything about it in case it was only my hearing. Freddie sounds like a robot, nothing like himself. It's incredibly bad. In fact the entire band sounds very artificial. There's so many 'digital artefacts', or whatever one could call it. And then there's the fact of merging both shows into one smooth concert, which obviously is anything but smooth.
I always loved Budapest official mix, I wonder what do you think about it?
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velizar
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Post by velizar on Apr 6, 2024 9:47:13 GMT
And then there's the fact of merging both shows into one smooth concert, which obviously is anything but smooth. The only explanation I can think of is that they wanted to fit in the two concerts within the limits of a singular CD (clocking at 01:19:40 out of 80 minutes) while omitting banter and probably picking the shorter renditions of each track. Still pissed at myself for buying the standard edition when I was a new fan, thinking that what I'd hear would be March Rainbow.
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manymilesaway
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Post by manymilesaway on Apr 6, 2024 11:05:56 GMT
And then there's the fact of merging both shows into one smooth concert, which obviously is anything but smooth. The only explanation I can think of is that they wanted to fit in the two concerts within the limits of a singular CD (clocking at 01:19:40 out of 80 minutes) while omitting banter and probably picking the shorter renditions of each track. Still pissed at myself for buying the standard edition when I was a new fan, thinking that what I'd hear would be March Rainbow. The official QPL PR explanation was that the footage of the individual nights were too damaged to be used. I think that's bullshit. The full first night has been screened in full on its own before, we know that. There's also documentary footage, old edits of the video, and footage used in public exhibits showing that there was DEFINITELY more footage than they were letting on. A two November show Blu-Ray set + March Rainbow as a bonus would be incredible- too bad Queen Productions is anything but incredible. I think they just didn't want to release the shows with all their warts (several power outages in the first night's Liar), and decided to make a frankenstein's monster of the highlights from both. It really sucks, because I actually think Queen's ability to adapt on the spot and quickly think of a way to work past the power outages was an AMAZING showing of how strong they were as a unit, even as early as 1974. Listen to the link I sent above, it's a completely new take on the "I have sinned dear father" part, and it sounds awesome! Too bad Queen Productions doesn't see it that way. I could maybe forgive AAALLL OF THAT if the editing and audio mixing were somewhat competent, but sadly that isn't the case. It's terrible. Queen Productions have NO right to shit on Saul Swimmer's edit of the Montreal footage when they so proudly released that HORRIBLE 2014 mess. Trash. It makes me sort of glad that the Earls Court twins haven't been released yet, would hate to see those shows massacred too.
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velizar
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Post by velizar on Apr 6, 2024 11:19:01 GMT
The only explanation I can think of is that they wanted to fit in the two concerts within the limits of a singular CD (clocking at 01:19:40 out of 80 minutes) while omitting banter and probably picking the shorter renditions of each track. Still pissed at myself for buying the standard edition when I was a new fan, thinking that what I'd hear would be March Rainbow. It makes me sort of glad that the Earls Court twins haven't been released yet, would hate to see those shows massacred too. Or even worse, see a (botched) official compilation of the 1979 Paris shows, just the thought of it makes my head hurt.
Aside of this, I can't help but notice that despite them having the whole first night on video, the 2014 release keeps many, if not most/all of the edits from the 1992 VHS (haven't watched both recently and I might be misremembering), so whoever edited the old release should take the blame. By saying this I'm by no mean defending QPL for their incompetence, but one can probably guess they took the masters for the old, slightly longer VHS print and let it out with minor modifications to it.
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Emmanuel
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Post by Emmanuel on Apr 6, 2024 15:00:45 GMT
The official QPL PR explanation was that the footage of the individual nights were too damaged to be used. I think that's bullshit. The full first night has been screened in full on its own before, we know that. There's also documentary footage, old edits of the video, and footage used in public exhibits showing that there was DEFINITELY more footage than they were letting on. As far I know, the first night on Rainbow was screened in 2011 on the Stormtroopers in Stilettos exhibition, most likely in 40-50 mins, it had a very rough color plus the audio wasn't the best. with the legend in the top left corner "Unseen Archive Footage" The only survivors of that footage is Flick Of The Wrist and Now I'm Here.
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Post by ethan6581 on Apr 8, 2024 1:57:12 GMT
You are terribly wrong about the worst November release. The fact that they couldn’t find a video of a March concert of the same year and on the same venue for more than three songs is what I would call the worst.The funny thing is that they asked fans who had videos of this concert more than three song, to send them a copy. Regarding the worst release, I would say Hammersmith Odeon 1975. They cut off Bob Harris's speech at the beginning, replacing only his voice. Nah, the November release is horrible in every way. The audio mix is terrible and the video editing is HORRIBLE. They don't even bother checking Roger's clothes, it changes just about every other shot. I could go on and on about how AWFUL the audio mix on November is, I cannot believe that that got out the way it did. How do you drown your mix in bass and yet I STILL can't hear Deacon?? The pitch correction is absolutely terrible in November, it's the worst I've ever heard from Queen. Freddie does not sound human. With March Rainbow, I can atleast understand the lackluster video release- what else are they supposed to do if they genuinely don't have all the footage? But the March audio mix is INSANELY GOOD, like easily the best officially released mix imo. I definitely agree. The November show has for sure the worst usage of over-dubbing and pitch correction than any other other live release in my opinion.
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Post by airpodsmax on Apr 9, 2024 14:42:27 GMT
And for some reason no one criticizes A Night At The Odeon 1975.
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Emmanuel
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And love lies bleeding in my hand, oh, it kills me to think of you with another man...
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Post by Emmanuel on Apr 10, 2024 0:10:55 GMT
And for some reason no one criticizes A Night At The Odeon 1975. It was terrible as Rainbow, pitch correction all over the place, they omitted Bob Harris' speech, the video quality was butchered by removing the video noise, the mix was crap, and the bonus, what we already have since 2011 (Omitting the documentary). The only thing I appreciate about A Night At The Odeon is the box set experience, giving replica tickets, tour date sheets, and wonderful books with unpublished pictures
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leighburne
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Post by leighburne on Apr 10, 2024 6:18:28 GMT
Nothing like a good old bit of internet hyperbole.
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Post by ThomasQuinn on Apr 10, 2024 6:45:45 GMT
Was Rainbow perfectly done? Nope. Is it anywhere near as terrible as some of the above posts make it out to be? Not even close. "Good old internet hyperbole" seems like a very charitable take, it's bordering on hysteria IMHO. Statements like "massacred", "unbearable", "trash" are quite ridiculous. All because of some overproduction and, oh the horror, editing footage of two nights into one. So heads up, music fans all over the world: by this standard pretty much all of the best-loved live albums of all time are "unbearable trash" that are unlistenable and hearing them is the worst thing that has ever happened to anyone...
As an aside - do the above posters who so despise Rainbow also go into shock over Freddie's vocals on "In The Lap Of The Gods"? Is the pitch-shift on "Going Back" unforgivable? Can we ever forgive the fact that not one, but multiple Queen-songs were cobbled together from several takes? And should people who enjoyed "Live Killers" be forcibly committed for their perverse enjoyment of such an atrocity, that is surely worse than murder?
Or maybe, just maybe, would it be advisable to get a sense of perspective instead of this doom-loop of negativity about a less-than-perfect but still quite decent live album?
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BrƎИsꓘi
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Post by BrƎИsꓘi on Apr 10, 2024 9:19:19 GMT
Was Rainbow perfectly done? Nope. Is it anywhere near as terrible as some of the above posts make it out to be? Not even close. "Good old internet hyperbole" seems like a very charitable take, it's bordering on hysteria IMHO. Statements like "massacred", "unbearable", "trash" are quite ridiculous. All because of some overproduction and, oh the horror, editing footage of two nights into one. So heads up, music fans all over the world: by this standard pretty much all of the best-loved live albums of all time are "unbearable trash" that are unlistenable and hearing them is the worst thing that has ever happened to anyone... As an aside - do the above posters who so despise Rainbow also go into shock over Freddie's vocals on "In The Lap Of The Gods"? Is the pitch-shift on "Going Back" unforgivable? Can we ever forgive the fact that not one, but multiple Queen-songs were cobbled together from several takes? And should people who enjoyed "Live Killers" be forcibly committed for their perverse enjoyment of such an atrocity, that is surely worse than murder? Or maybe, just maybe, would it be advisable to get a sense of perspective instead of this doom-loop of negativity about a less-than-perfect but still quite decent live album? absolutely this ^ i can't believe the sensitivities of folk. people cannot imagine the absolute joy of hearing a live album release immediately following the respective tour. Live Killers (and all of it's butchering) was a joy to behold back in 1979 - an absolute fucking joy! oh, and interesting related/unrelated fact: The (arguably) greatest live rock album of all time was nothing of the sort. Thin Lizzy's Live & Dangerous is so overdubbed that it was joked that the only element of the recording that is actually live is the crowd noise. back on topic, i remember seeing Rainbow 74 in the cinema early 80s (support feature to Pink Floyd The Wall) and loved every minute of it's incredible half-hr showing.
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Lord Fickle
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Post by Lord Fickle on Apr 10, 2024 10:17:29 GMT
Was Rainbow perfectly done? Nope. Is it anywhere near as terrible as some of the above posts make it out to be? Not even close. "Good old internet hyperbole" seems like a very charitable take, it's bordering on hysteria IMHO. Statements like "massacred", "unbearable", "trash" are quite ridiculous. All because of some overproduction and, oh the horror, editing footage of two nights into one. So heads up, music fans all over the world: by this standard pretty much all of the best-loved live albums of all time are "unbearable trash" that are unlistenable and hearing them is the worst thing that has ever happened to anyone... As an aside - do the above posters who so despise Rainbow also go into shock over Freddie's vocals on "In The Lap Of The Gods"? Is the pitch-shift on "Going Back" unforgivable? Can we ever forgive the fact that not one, but multiple Queen-songs were cobbled together from several takes? And should people who enjoyed "Live Killers" be forcibly committed for their perverse enjoyment of such an atrocity, that is surely worse than murder? Or maybe, just maybe, would it be advisable to get a sense of perspective instead of this doom-loop of negativity about a less-than-perfect but still quite decent live album? absolutely this ^ i can't believe the sensitivities of folk. people cannot imagine the absolute joy of hearing a live album release immediately following the respective tour. Live Killers (and all of it's butchering) was a joy to behold back in 1979 - an absolute fucking joy! Agreed. I remember hearing the fast WWRY for the first time, and it was just amazing, as was the faster version of Now I'm Here. Despite the editing, between track fades, and not the greatest production, it's still a fantastic live album. oh, and interesting related/unrelated fact: The (arguably) greatest live rock album of all time was nothing of the sort. Thin Lizzy's Live & Dangerous is so overdubbed that it was joked that the only element of the recording that is actually live is the crowd noise. I think that theory has been somewhat debunked by the release of the 8 disc L&D box set, which featured all of the recordings that made up the original live album. Yes, there were some overdubs, but it was more taking bits of one night and mixing them with bits of another. It's fascinating listening to all of the concerts and picking out the bits that appeared on the live album. I wish Queen would do that with the Live Killers recordings.
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ted
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Post by ted on Apr 10, 2024 10:37:02 GMT
Thanks for your input, TQ, Brenski and LF. I mostly agree with your sentiments; on the whole, I don't regard Live Killers so highly but it does have it's moments of greatness, i.e. Spread Your Wings, Let Me Entertain You.
Ted
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pg
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Post by pg on Apr 10, 2024 12:57:02 GMT
I like Live Killers. I like the Rainbow. I like Hammersmith. Rather listen to them than any album post The Game. Clearly my ears are more defective than my musical taste.....
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Párys
Satyr
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Post by Párys on Apr 10, 2024 13:27:22 GMT
My favorite is the March concert at the Rainbow Theatre. It probably sounds the most believable compared to the November show
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pg
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Post by pg on Apr 10, 2024 13:42:36 GMT
My favorite is the March concert at the Rainbow Theatre. It probably sounds the most believable compared to the November show Ironically, that's probably the one with more overdubs, given that the original edit (the Sheetkeeckers bootleg) was the planned live album that was shelved.
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Párys
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Post by Párys on Apr 10, 2024 13:45:36 GMT
My favorite is the March concert at the Rainbow Theatre. It probably sounds the most believable compared to the November show Ironically, that's probably the one with more overdubs, given that the original edit (the Sheetkeeckers bootleg) was the planned live album that was shelved. Despite the overdubs, it still sounds a hundred times better😂
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billy
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Post by billy on Apr 11, 2024 4:08:30 GMT
I love Live Killers. It was the first Queen album I bought since it was the closest thing to a greatest hits type album available after I discovered (or learned or realized or was told by somebody smarter than me) that one band made so many of the songs I loved on the radio. I used to fall asleep every night listening to side 3. To my young ears it was wonderful! I had no idea how it had been Frankensteined together. Even after I learned that I didn’t really care. It was my gateway drug if you will to a lifelong love of Queen. I then bought all their albums as I saved up money. My first studio album bought on the day of release was Hot Space - which I also love so go figure. I eventually found bootlegs in the “ROIO” section of mom and pop record stores. I loved the rawness of Queen’s live sound - mistakes and warts and all. But Live Killers will always hold a special place in my heart.
Hey since the 45th anniversary of Live Killers is only about two months away this would be the perfect time to release that fabled box set lol 🙂
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eiricd
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Post by eiricd on Apr 11, 2024 8:28:20 GMT
if it's indeed true that they have both november nights on video/audio, the mashup release is slightly disappointing. I suppose the ship has sailed for a new version where both gigs are included.
Despite technical issues on the first night (how severe?) they should put it out for historical purpose.
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BrƎИsꓘi
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Post by BrƎИsꓘi on Apr 11, 2024 10:25:39 GMT
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manymilesaway
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Post by manymilesaway on Apr 12, 2024 12:57:37 GMT
Despite technical issues on the first night (how severe?) they should put it out for historical purpose. From what we know, there were atleast two power cuts during Liar. One that occurs shortly before the documentary clip, and then the one that happens during it. There's likely a lot more though.
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JackG
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Post by JackG on Apr 12, 2024 13:56:18 GMT
My favorite is the March concert at the Rainbow Theatre. It probably sounds the most believable compared to the November show Mine too, I hope the supposed 38-min 16mm footage from the archive show up, with Big Spender and Bama Lama Bama Loo included. I still don't get it why Big Spender was in the November show but omitted in the March show. (Didn't want to pay royalties? prob)
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Párys
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Post by Párys on Apr 12, 2024 16:21:01 GMT
My favorite is the March concert at the Rainbow Theatre. It probably sounds the most believable compared to the November show Mine too, I hope the supposed 38-min 16mm footage from the archive show up, with Big Spender and Bama Lama Bama Loo included. I still don't get it why Big Spender was in the November show but omitted in the March show. (Didn't want to pay royalties? prob) I'm bummed they left out these two songs. Why can't the March show be complete?! Is it such a problem to release it as a whole?
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Ri
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Post by Ri on Apr 12, 2024 16:43:54 GMT
John Harris making appearances for a Japanese Queen locations tour and Queen fan convention... John Anthony getting back in touch with the band... something something early Queen (live?) tapes revival era
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Post by airpodsmax on Apr 12, 2024 17:12:57 GMT
John Harris making appearances for a Japanese Queen locations tour and Queen fan convention... John Anthony getting back in touch with the band... something something early Queen (live?) tapes revival era Hmm, sounds interesting but incomplete
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